Dr. Stephen Hussey: The Heart is Not a Pump – Debunking the Conventional Narratives of Heart Disease

A 34-year-old, with “great numbers” and clean imaging, has a widowmaker heart attack, and then recovers without the usual long-term medication stack. That story alone forces us to question what we really know about the heart. I sat down with chiropractor and functional medicine practitioner Dr. Stephen Hussey, author of Understanding the Heart, to rebuild the heart disease conversation from first principles and from lived experience.

We challenge the default plumbing narrative of cardiovascular disease and dig into a model where the heart functions less like a pressure pump and more like a vortex-based hydraulic system working with flow that is already moving. From there we unpack structured water, also called exclusion zone water or the fourth phase of water, and why infrared light, circadian rhythm, and the glycocalyx matter when you’re thinking about blood flow, clotting risk, endothelial health, and inflammation. If you’ve ever wondered why “oxidative stress” seems to connect to everything, you’ll hear a unifying lens that ties energy, charge, and modern environmental stressors together.

We also go straight at the biggest pressure points in cardiology: what high blood pressure numbers do and do not mean, how statin benefits can look different when you focus on absolute risk reduction, what blood thinners actually do to the clotting cascade, and why stents and bypass procedures don’t necessarily prevent future heart attacks. We finish with arrhythmias and ablations, plus the practical, grounded steps Dr. Hussey uses to support nervous system balance and heart health.

If this perspective helps you think more clearly about cholesterol, heart attack causes, and heart disease prevention, subscribe, share this with someone who needs it, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.

RESOURCES

• Dr. Stephen Hussey's Website
• Gerald Pollack's video on Fourth Phase Water
• Heart Attack Survivors Do No Better on Beta Blockers
• What is a Natural Human Diet? - Part Two
• Structured Water Interview with Jonathon Butts

Reverse Any Chronic Health Condition in Three Steps - The Simplest Path to Healing You've Ever Seen

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hello everyone, welcome to episode number 68. I've got another fascinating interview for you all today. In my last episode, Mr. G. Edward Griffin and I deconstructed the second leading cause of death, cancer. In this episode, my guest and I are taking on the number one leading cause of death, heart disease. Now, admittedly, my guest, Dr. Stephen Hussey, does most of the heavy lifting in this one, but he is a wizard at synthesizing biology and scientific studies and practical language into his own fascinating story, which, as you'll hear, involved having a so-called widowmaker heart attack at the age of 34. Similar to my last episode, this was a fun interview because we stepped back and asked some fundamental questions that the medical system either doesn't bother with or would prefer we not ask when coming to understand diseases

Why Heart Disease Deserves A Reset

SPEAKER_01 0:52

of the heart. And as you've hopefully come to expect from me by now, we took some time to define our terms and to explain some basic biology. And Dr. Husse and I discussed the conventional model of heart and heart disease and contrasted it with what I think is a much more holistic and paradigm-shifting perspective on the heart. This was especially fun to study because it connected so many dots of things I've understood about physiology, but hadn't seen how they were related to each other. So during parts of this interview, I was learning right alongside you about what I could argue may be our most misunderstood organ. And perhaps my favorite overall takeaway was simply having such a rich logical explanation for what the heart is up to. And it helped me have a deeper appreciation for m how magnificent the human body is. It also helped make health and healing feel simpler. And it left me feeling grounded. And I, as I think you'll hear, besides being deeply practical, it was also just a fantastic antidote to fear. Okay, so besides Dr. Hussey's book, Understanding the Heart, which is chalk full of references, maybe the most intriguing companion I can point you to for this episode to better help you visualize some of the concepts we talk about is a video by Dr. Gerald Pollock talking about what he and those who have come before him have referred to as the fourth phase of water. We tend to think of water as only having a solid, liquid, and gas state. And what's so fascinating about Dr. Pollock's work is the video footage of this fourth or gel phase of water. In the video I'll link for you, you get to see the gel phase happen in real time with relatively easy to replicate experiments. The implications of understanding the body and the heart through the lens of this fourth phase of water are far reaching. One thing this understanding definitively

Fourth Phase Water And The Heart

SPEAKER_01 2:47

demonstrates is the mind-bending overlap of electricity, magnetism, and chemistry as they interface with water. And the easiest place to see this interface in the body is the heart. It's not just amazing biology, it's a window into a substance, structured or fourth phase water, that not only has tremendous healing potential, but also has the potential to produce and store energy, including inside us. So I won't spoil all the implications of that, but I will link Dr. Pollock's video in the show notes, and Dr. Husse does a great job of explaining and exploring that as well. So, of all the different systems or organs of the body we could study, the heart may be the organ that can teach us the most about who we are and how the body works. Dr. Hussey is so practiced at explaining the heart, and there are not many items on my list I'd wanted to discuss with him that I did not get to. So we covered the three main categories of pharmaceutical interventions related to heart disease. Those are statins, blood pressure regulators, and blood thinners. We also talked about three, two of the three major types of surgeries for the heart, ablasions, which we defined during the interview. But one thing we didn't get to was to look into ablations statistically, they have a 60 to 90% success rate, which is the positive way of saying they have a 10 to 40% failure rate. So essentially an average of one out of four ablations fail, which I thought was a nugget worth including since you may not be offered that level of informed consent. The second type of surgeries we discussed are those for blocked arteries, or more specifically bypass or stent procedures.

Meds Surgery And Informed Consent

SPEAKER_01 4:24

That was eye-opening because we talked about how the body is so intelligent that if an artery starts becoming constricted, the body will construct additional pipes called collaterals to go around the blockages and make sure the heart has enough blood supply. The surgery we didn't have time to discuss was heart transplants. So let me give you some context for why I'm bringing that up. During the interview, when Dr. Hussey was laying out a holistic three-part definition of the heart, the third aspect he mentioned is that the heart has a very strong and easily measurable frequency that it puts out. That's part of what EKGs are measuring. Now, humanity has known for a long time that there's something special about the heart. And you can think of it this way: no one ever says, I love you with all of my foot, or or even like, I love you with all of my brain, right? It would be weird or even off-putting if someone said that. And we just instinctively think, really? You don't have you don't feel anything for me? And again, there's something special about the heart. And in the Bible, it talks about guarding your heart, for it is the wellspring of life. In the New Testament, Jesus talks about how out of the abundance or overflow of the heart, the mouth speaks. And we even use phrases like heart of hearts to talk about our deepest or most honest parts of who we are. And the point here, and both Dr. Hussey and Dr. Pollock point this out, is that it's important to recognize the heart is so much more than an organ that moves blood. And why I bring why do I bring this up? Well, one of the most intriguing aspects of the heart is that it literally does store parts of who we are. So much so that people who receive heart transplants have repeatedly been shown to take on characteristics of the donor, characteristics they had never exhibited before, like cravings or habits or who they are attracted to, or even memories of things that happened to the donor, which is totally mind-bending, but it's a reminder that we are so much more than just a meat suit, and that health and healing goes way beyond a genetic or chemistry-centric puzzle. If we stay stuck in, say, the chemistry-centric box, which is where the drug companies and many supplement companies want us to stay, we can't see a more holistic way of viewing the body. So hopefully this episode helps you see an approachable and even reverent way to think about your heart, your body, and your fellow humans. Okay, shifting gears a bit, one other fun nugget I wanted to ask Dr. Husse about, which he covers in more detail in his book, is the reality that we rarely, if ever, hear about heart cancer, or for that matter, muscle cancer, and the heart is largely muscle tissue. So the question is, why doesn't cancer strike the heart? And he hints at why, as we are talking about nutrition, and it has to do with the heart's preference for fat as fuel rather than sugar. So given that cancer cells reproduce using fermentation, which uses a lot of sugar, it begins to explain why the heart rarely produces cancer cells. Anyway, the reason I bring that up is because that theme will come up again in future episodes. So in case you heard my last episode about cancer, or if you hear me talking about the role of sugar as it relates to cancer, I wanted to give you some intellectual pegs to hang new knowledge on. Okay, two last thoughts before I play the episode. First is that if the topic of structured water is interesting to you, I have a whole episode about that with the late Mr. Jonathan Butts. That episode is number 25. Second is if Dr. Hussey and I didn't give you enough pause to rethink the narratives about cholesterol and cholesterol-lowering medications, you might check out my monologue episode, which is where I discussed what I call the cholesterol myth. That is episode number seven, and it is called What is a Natural Human Diet Part 2. I also discussed uh the topic of statins with Dr. Gessling. There is a conversation recorded about that that you can only find in the Healing United PMA app. That discussion is in the free resources section. Just look for the heading Pharma-Free Living. If you're listening to this in the app, you're just a few clicks away. Okay, as always, nothing in this episode is meant to be personal health advice. For that, seek out the help of someone you trust. Okay, without further ado, here is to a deeper and more grounded understanding of the human body and to a calm intuition about how to care for it. Welcome to my interview with an articulate teacher and a deep thinker, Dr. Stephen Hussey. Hello, everyone. Welcome to today's show. My guest is Dr. Stephen Hussey. So let me tell you a bit about this amazing guy. He is a chiropractor and functional medicine practitioner. He attained his both his doctorate of chiropractic and master's in human nutrition and functional medicine from the University of Western States in Portland, Oregon. He is a speaker and fellow health coach who works with clients all over the world. He is the author of three books. The one we're going to be talking about today is called Understanding the Heart. Also relevant to this episode is that he was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at age nine. And at age 34, he had what is referred to as a widow maker heart attack. So obviously he survived that and is here to tell the tale. In his downtime, he likes to be outdoors,

Meet Dr Stephen Hussey

SPEAKER_01 9:37

play sports, read, write, and travel. And it sounds like my kind of guy. So Dr. Hussey, welcome to the show. Thanks for joining me today.

SPEAKER_00 9:44

Yeah, thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_01 9:46

Well, it's so I know from reading your book that about the heart that ironically you were in the middle of writing it when you had the heart attack. And uh you also had a season of being a vegan, uh, and then you were in a very personally stressful time when you had the heart attack. So let's just start with that story and add any relevant context that I may have left out and just give us the story of the heart attack, and we'll use that to start to compare two very different models of the heart and of heart disease more specifically.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

Sure. Yeah, and I think that based on kind of how you introduce it there, what I want to say is that, you know, there's there's plenty of opportunities or details about my stories that would give opportunities for you to say, oh, that was the cause, right? Oh, that was it. And then you don't have to think about it anymore. Oh, you figured out why this person had a heart attack and it's easy to explain, right? You can say, Oh, type 1 diabetes. Uh, you can say, Oh, the the diet that I was eating, because I was on a I went on a vegan diet for like two years, a long time ago, well before the heart attack. Um, but at the time of the heart attack, I was eating a mostly animal-based diet. And people would say, Oh, that was the cause, or the fact that I have what's called lean mass hyperresponder numbers, which means that if I go on a low carb diet, which I do to manage type 1 diabetes, my LDL goes up. People say, Oh, it was the LDL, that's what caused it. There's so many things that you could just say, oh, and it's simple, right? The only problem is none of those things fully explain what

The Widowmaker Heart Attack Story

SPEAKER_00 11:05

happened to me when you look at the research. It's basically just uh an excuse not to look any deeper. Um, and so, so yeah, I'll kind of outline the story as people are real familiar with why I do this and why I talk about this today. So, yeah, as you mentioned, um, I'm a type one diabetic, but even before that, I had a lot of inflammatory conditions as a kid. Um, I used to break out in hives all over my body, and all the doctors would do just throw steroids at me. Um, I used to have terrible allergies, asthma. Um, anytime I'd even just laugh hard or like uh exercise, I would have an asthma attack. Um, and yeah, those types of things. And even IBS at times, just terrible stomach pains. Uh, and so yeah, my parents and I just kind of relied on Western medicine to help us manage those conditions. And it wasn't until college that I started to realize that I could live my life a certain way, change my lifestyle, and have a direct impact on all those things. And I got rid of all those things aside from the type one diabetes, but I managed it much easier when I changed my lifestyle. And I was like, why didn't no doctor tell me about this? Like, what why didn't they tell me I could change the they just basically, when I was a kid, I was I was given a book that listed every single fast food menu uh item uh in any restaurant and just the amount of carbohydrates because that's all that mattered, is they just said, count the carbohydrates, give your body insulin for it. That's all that I had to do to manage this condition. Um, and yeah, so, anyways, and so that kind of pushed me into this direction of being curious about health. Um, and so I majored in health and models in college, and then I went, um, I thought about going to medical school and I got disillusioned with that um because you know, they never told me to do these things and I would have this impact on my life. And I thought that was interesting. I was like, maybe I don't want to know what they know. And I was starting to get understand the shortcomings of Western medicine from it, some people, um, professors and and and other classmates in college and stuff. So I went to chiropractic school. Um, and then I, you know, went and got a master's degree in human nutrition and functional medicine after that. And I like to say that those degrees taught me a lot about what we think we know, um, a lot of like the basic education that we think we understand. Um, but what I've learned since is is much more than that. And so, yeah, I'd always controlled my health through diet and exercise. That was the main things that changed. And so it was various diets. I mean, like I said, I was on that vegan diet for a few years while I was in chiropractic school, and then, you know, realized that that wasn't the best for me. Um, and then went like more paleo and then uh keto and then a carnivore at times and things like that, and and found the diets that worked best for me. Um and and then exercise. I've always been athletic, played a lot of sports, uh, still do um when I can. And and so those things were kind of what you would think would perplex protect them, but that's what we hear from from the conventional system is that, yeah, diet and exercise, that's how you prevent disease, that's how you prevent heart disease. And then at 34 years old, um, I had a widowmaker heart attack uh out of the blue. Like my testing looked perfect. I had no calcified plaque, no plaque in general in my arteries. My metabolic health was great. Uh, like I said, my my cholesterol was slightly elevated according to the authorities. Um, and it's easy to point at that. Um, but I know why it was that way because of this literature we have now on lean mass IP responders. Um, and uh, and so yeah, I still had this heart attack. And people will say, we know what caused it. And that's a very common rooted answer, which I'm sure we'll get into. But, you know, there was a lot of stress happening at the time. So that's one of the main issues that was happening. Um, things that were somewhat out of my control. Um, and then a very stressful thing that happened a day and a half before the heart attack that we couldn't resolve, my family and I couldn't resolve. And so, yeah, but then the story continues, and that's what I'm known for now is that despite having this heart attack at 34, I kind of uh, you know, I was in the hospital, I was kind of like, okay, guys, what happened? You know, tell me what happened and what should I do about it? And I was just very disappointed with what I got, which I kind of was expecting, you know, like they had no explanation besides a broken record, oh, cholesterol causes this. The cholesterol is high, that's what, that's what caused this. And I was just like, that's kind of a BS answer, I'd say. Um, and so, and then they wanted me on five medications the rest of my life and and all these things, right? Um, the the care I got in the hospital um was to me just this big lack of understanding of what actually creates health, and more just we have a cookie cutter protocol to follow, and we have to do that. So I decided not to do those things. I took the only medication I took was a blood thinner for six months because they did place a stint. Um, and over the next year and a half, uh my heart completely recovered without those medications. I've prevented heart failure, which they told me without the medications, I was much more likely to get. Um, I reversed a 75 to 99% blockage of plaque in my leg that happened and developed because of the heart calf procedure they did. Uh and then, and then I got a CT angiogram of my heart arteries about a year and a few months ago. And uh, and they're clean. Uh, there's a very small amount of plaque in the right coronary artery that's um that was there at the time of the heart attack, so it hasn't progressed, but everything else is very clean, just even downstream from the stin, everything looks good. So I did that, you know, you know, my diet stayed the same, low carb, LDL stayed the same. Uh, I only took the blood thinner for six months. Uh, what I changed was uh my exercise stayed the same as soon as I figured out that with this plaque in my leg, I could ride a bike and it wouldn't hurt my leg. Um, I could so I could my exercise stayed generally the same. Um, and then uh, but what I changed was my light environment mainly. So what light I'm exposed to in wind, circadian rhythm. Um, I started using an infrared sauna, started doing a lot of grounding. Uh, I took a few supplements for about a year, and then yeah, over this year and a half, I I completely reversed things. Um, and I feel healthier than I ever have been. So, so yeah, it's an interesting story that uh to me inspires lots of questions uh about not only the traditional way that medicine treats it, looks at this thing, what causes heart attacks, how do we address someone afterwards, but also how did I get this healing? And is there more than just diet and exercise when it comes to the conversation around heart disease? So, yeah, that's that's what I do.

SPEAKER_01 17:11

And you do it well. It's fun. Your book was it gave me so many new nuggets. I've been trying to just get back to the basics of studying physiology and try to attempt to ask what is the body attempting to do here and why would it be doing those things? And you just can't, there's many elements of your book that was just a feast of like, oh, that's what it's doing, of course. So before we get to kind of the your theory of what happened to you or a different understanding of heart disease, flesh out a little bit more what is the conventional theory of what happened to you, or just of heart disease in general. You mentioned cholesterol, but what would they tell you, or what would conventional textbooks or medical school say this is why he got the heart attack, and this is um the cause of heart disease?

SPEAKER_00 17:54

Um, yeah, so I mean, when they went in there and intervened, you know, like this is one time when Western medicine is useful, right? They're very good in emergency, they can do amazing things. Um and uh and so when they went in to intervene, they found a 100% blockage in the left coronary artery, left anter descending coronary artery, which is the most common place for a heart attack to happen. Uh and so, however, I

The Standard Plaque Rupture Narrative

SPEAKER_00 18:20

could argue that that blockage had nothing to do with the heart attack. Uh, it was not the cause. I I I could argue that it could have been though. But the question we need to ask then is how did it get there? Right? Because it's hard for me to believe that I had a 100% blockage of plaque in an artery and there was no calcified plaque. Um, so it couldn't have been this gradual buildup of plaque over time that slowly closed it. But then they'll say, well, plaque rupture caused that, right? Um, so let's say that this plaque builds up because cholesterol gets clogged in there or whatever. Um, and then eventually that plaque can get inflamed and it'll rupture, and that rupture will cause the clotting response and it blocks the whole artery, and then that's what it is. Um, and you know, I've asked eight different interventional cardiologists at this point that when they go in there to intervene during a heart attack and they see a blockage, what tells them that it was what makes it absolutely certain that it was a plaque rupture? And none of them can really give me a straight answer. Um, many of them have said, well, it's inferred because that's the theory. And we find that thing and we infer that's what happened, but there's no real evidence for it. Um, so yeah, and there's also a paper uh written in 2015 um called The Myth of the Vulnerable Plaque, where the authors reviewed all the um evidence for this plaque rupture theory of heart attacks and found that plaque ruptures happen all the time, but they don't cause heart attacks, or very rarely are they the cause of a heart attack. So, so yeah, there's that whole theory, but that's that's the conventional way that they think about it. They think that these pipes in our body, uh in the heart, uh, develop this plaque, and that plaque is deposited because of high cholesterol, and then eventually that closes up the whole artery or it ruptures and that causes a clot, blocks the artery, we don't get blood downstream, and that's what causes the heart attack. Um, so I have many different uh other theories and rebuttals and information that shows that that stuff's not true. But if it's not true, then what does, right? That's the important question. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Okay, well, that great. So I part of deconstructing the conventional theory of heart disease is just to zoom out and ask the question well, what is the heart? Because if we get that wrong, we're likely going to be off course trying to define heart disease or how to take care of the heart. So on a biological level, correct me if I'm wrong, but the conventional model sees the heart as a pump, whereas an alternative way to see it is that the heart is not a pump, but a vortex. So, in other words, it's funny to think about if you watch the heart movie, you can see it. All four chambers don't contract and expand simultaneously, they move in a sequence, and it's the swirling of the fluid as it passes through. So I guess talk about two things here. Why does the model of the heart as a pump break down? And what are the implications for viewing the heart as a vortex instead of a pump?

SPEAKER_00 21:03

Yeah. I mean, there's there's uh I mean, in my book I talk a lot

Why The Heart Is Not A Pump

SPEAKER_00 21:07

about this. So that's one place people can get more, but there's also another book by Dr. Branco first, which is probably the most comprehensive, the most literature. And there's tons of citations in that book suggesting that if we look at the heart as a pressure propulsion pump, that it doesn't act like that. It doesn't act like that at all. And it's very inefficient if we look if we think of it like that. There's studies that show that if we look at the heart as a pressure propulsion pump based on the energy that it expends, it's only about 10 to 15% efficient, which is not a very good way to design something, you know, if you were going to design that. Um, so that can't be uh it doesn't make sense that it would be that way. Um and the other thing is there's there's lots of scientists over the last 200 years who have called in the question um that the heart is big enough, strong enough to be this forceful pressure propulsion pump that pumps the blood throughout the body. It's the driver of. Of the circulation. And I'm not saying it doesn't do any pumping, but it's a very small amount. It's no more than enough to maybe kind of move the blood a little bit through the chambers of the heart itself. But there's no way it could be what drives the circulation once it leaves the heart. And so, so yeah, like I would argue that the heart is not a pressure propulsion pump. A pressure propulsion pump is a type of pump that takes stagnant water and sucks it in from here and then forcefully pumps it out somewhere else. And that's not what the heart is. The heart is actually two, you know, uh contraptions, two mechan uh um mechanisms here, the left and the right side, that are inserted into a system where fluid is already moving through it, right? It's moving from the venous side through the heart to the lungs and then back to the heart and then um to the arterial side. So the the fluid is moving through it. It's not like it's stagnant water that it's sucking out and forcing somewhere else. Further, if I was going to forcefully pressure propulsion pump uh fluid from the bottom of a hill or to the to the top of a hill, I would put the pump at the bottom of the hill. Right? So it doesn't make sense that the heart is here and it's responsible for moving the blood from my feet back up to here. There's there's no way. Like, and there's actually people who have you know constructed um models of the heart and tried to use a pressure propulsion or models of the cardiovascular system itself and tried to use a pressure propulsion pump to make that work, and they couldn't make it work. Um, it just it could kept getting backed up. There's no way they could do it. And so um turns out that I mean, way back in you know the 1920s, Rudolf Steiner um compared the heart to a hydraulic RAM that is also vortexing, right? So a hydraulic RAM is a type of pump, it's a hydraulic RAM pump, but it's very different than a pressure propulsion pump. So I didn't necessarily understand what a hydraulic ram was when I read that. I had to go look it up, and there's good YouTube videos that teach you what it is. But basically it it's uh it's flow activated. So this hydraulic RAM only works if there's fluid flowing into it. So most of the time, you know, in engineering, they'll have water in a reservoir flowing down. So there's gravity taking the water down to it, and that's how it operates because it's it's it's uh it's more based on pressure dynamics and pressure changes that drive the system from happening. And if you look at that, and in my book, I make the comparable or analogous analogous structures from a hydraulic RAM to um one side of the heart, the right side is a hydraulic RAM and the left side is a hydraulic ram. There's two hydro hydraulic rams put together. Um and so yeah, and so if if that's the case, right, then it's very important. And the implications there are if we don't understand or if medicine doesn't understand what the true function of the heart and the body is, how are they supposed to understand how to make it function better when something goes wrong? Right. And so that's the issue, right? Is they they they see it as a pressure propulsion pump. And and so when the heart is failing, they see the pressure propulsion pump as failing. But in reality, it's failing because it's not supposed to be a pressure propulsion pump and it's having to act more like one than it's supposed to, because other mechanisms are not getting fluid to move like they're supposed to. Um, so so yeah, I mean that's one role of the heart as a is a as a hydraulic ram that vortexes fluid as it comes through it. So if you look at not just how the heart contracts and how it spirals like this when it contracts, um, and there's plenty of you know, modern day medical scientists that have discovered that. There's a whole video on YouTube you can watch called the helical heart that'll show all these higher-up cardiologists doing research that they acknowledge that very ready readily, but medicine seems to just ignore it, right? Um, and then it also uh when water flows into the chambers of the heart, um, then it actually gets vortexed. It's it's swished around, right? So as it flows in, it kind of goes around in a circle. If it goes past the valves, it'll eddy on the other sides. Um, it's and then when the heart contracts itself, it kind of vortexes it and spirals it as it as it pushes, it gives a little push out. Um, and so the purpose of the heart is to create this vortex. So if you think about water in nature, which the blood is half water, and the blood is also the salinity of the ocean. Um, when you think about that in nature, like nature is always moving water. It's flowing through rivers, um, it's crashing on the beach in waves, there's tidal currents moving the water, evaporation precipitation, like it's moving and it's getting swished around. There's white water, right? Whether that's at the beach or or the rapids or whatever. And it turns out that one of the ways that we can energize water, because water can hold energy, is to swish it around, vortex it in the presence of oxygen. So the blood always has oxygen in there. Um some would say that it's electrons more than oxygen that we're really vortexing it in. Um, but but that's the purpose. So if you take if you take um water and you put it in tubes, like laminar tubes, like our arteries and veins, it needs something there to energize it. And that's why there's a heart in the middle of the artery and the venous system to create that vortex mechanism. So it's just basically there to swish up water as it goes through. The other role of the heart is to actually slow the flow of blood during exertion, right? So if we were to go sprint or exercise or do something, then the tissue demand for nutrients and electrons and oxygen would be so great in the tissues that all the blood would flow over to the arterial side and the venous side wouldn't have enough fluid to keep it open, enough hydraulic pressure, and it would collapse and we would die. So the heart is actually there to slow the flow of blood during exertion. And there's elegant studies that show that in endurance athletes that the reason that we get this um cardiac um like exercise hypertrophy of the heart is not because the heart is more efficient at pumping blood, it's because it's more efficient at stopping the blood. Um the heart gets bigger so that it can catch the blood, the onslaught of blood that's happening, so it can be more efficient at stopping it and slowing it down, so we can maintain pressure between the artery and venous sides. Um, so that's the other role of the heart. And then the third role of the heart is very um, very emotional, very uh esoteric, very um electromagnetic. So the heart gives off the biggest electromagnetic field of any organ in the body because of the mitochondrial content combined with the vortexing of the heart, which amplifies the electromagnetic field. And that is what allows us to reach out into our environment and sense our environment. So the heart is a sensory organ responding to our environment. Um, and there's other organs that have those sensory components to them well, but none as much as the heart. Um, so those are the three roles of the heart. And to me, that's the true purpose of it. And and when we look at it as this, you know, mechanical pressure propulsion pump, it's it doesn't really seem to be working for us as far as medicine goes. They can't restore the function of it when they try and restore the function of it that way because they're missing out on what actually makes it operate like it's supposed to operate. And that's why they're struggling so much with things like heart failure. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:51

Wow. The fascinating. I told you guys we'll stretch your thinking here today. It's it's a fun part of once you get a different model, your questions start to change too. Okay, if that's what the heart does, then there are other implications for how I take care of it. So, one topic that's hard to not talk about in this different view of the heart is the concept of vortex or structured water, because the water itself has its own properties. And that was a fascinating aspect of your book. And you talked about kind of this lattice structure or this exclusion zone where there's the the vortex or structured water basically creates its own, it's almost like its own distillery or its own reverse osmosis where nothing gets in that water. And it's almost like this protective barrier for the lining of the arteries or the circulatory pipes. So talk a little bit about the significance or the role of water being structured and this concept of an exclusion zone and how that relates to a more holistic understanding of the heart.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

Yeah. Um, yeah, it's a perfect, perfect segue into like why,

Structured Water Explains Blood Flow

SPEAKER_00 29:51

because people are probably wondering, well, if the heart's not moving the blood, then how's the blood move? Right. Right, exactly. And so that's what we're talking about. So just to kind of set this up, and just I'm glad you asked this because I was just outside sitting in the sun, which I do most days. I'll sit in the sun for about an hour or something. And uh I've I've done this many times before, but I'll just be sitting there, literally doing nothing. I've been doing nothing, sitting there in the sun for the last 40 minutes, and I'll take my pulse and it's like 100, 110 is my pulse. It's just like I'm doing nothing. I'm not stressed, I'm not getting a stress response, right, uh, from anywhere. I'm just reading a book. And uh, and why is my heart rate so high, right? Um, because we were we're told that if the heart rate increases, right, then that's that means it's pumping more forcefully, or not maybe not necessarily more forcefully, but more rapidly. It's pumping more fluid, right? But I'm sitting there doing nothing. Why is my heart rate so elevated, so to speak, or high up like that? And the reason is is because I'm sitting in the sun, but I'm sitting in the sun and my body is is building structured water because infrared light is the main way we do this. So, what is structured water? So, water is a unique liquid. We know that it can exist as ice, as water, and as steam, but there's actually a fourth phase it can exist in, and it's what we call structured water or exclusion zone water. And basically, under the right conditions, um, when water holds energy, and when that water is next to a water-loving or hydrophilic surface, which is any biological surface is water-loving, then it will actually structure itself. It will rearrange its molecules a little bit and become this gel-like form of water. So it's not like between ice and liquid, it's kind of like the consistency of raw egg white. Um, and so yeah, what happens is like an oxygen and like the oxygen and two hydrogens of water, one of the hydrogens is cleaved off. And then the oxygen and hydrogen that are left can team up with these other oxygens and hydrogens, and they form this lattice-like structure, like you mentioned. Um, and that lattice-like structure can then like form these kind of panels that kind of line up next to that hydrophilic surface, and we get this layer of gel-like water there. Now, um, this gel-like water has some unique properties. Uh, one, it's called exclusion zone water because, like you mentioned, it excludes anything that's not it. So the only thing that can penetrate it is very small hydrated ions of minerals. So everything else can't, right? So if we're talking about the lining of a blood vessel, um, which is the cardiovascular system, they've shown that this structured water forms on the lining of the blood vessel, which means that it's pushing anything that's in the blood itself away from the wall of the artery, meaning red blood cells, meaning cholesterol, lipoproteins that carry cholesterol, meaning smaller proteins, uh, meaning bacteria, anything can't touch the lining of the artery if we have structured water that's healthy and intact. Also, um, structured water provides a frictionless surface. It's it's slick. So the example here is if you ever take an ice out of the freezer and it sticks to your finger at first, um, and you're like, ah, get this ice off, you know. Um, but then as soon as the ice starts to melt, the hydrophilic surface of your finger and of the ice, structured water forms between your finger and the ice and it slips right off because it's structured water creates this frictionless barrier. Um, but also they've done experiments in Dr. Pollock's lab where they put a tube made of a hydrophilic solution or substance into a vat of water and then they shine infrared light on the water, structured water forms around the tube and it starts to move the water through the tube with no pump acting on it whatsoever, right? And so the reason that happens is because when you cleave off that hydrogen of structured water or water and you form structured water with what's left, the oxygen's a bigger molecule and it's very electronegatively charged, and it teams up with the other oxygens and hydrogens, and it forms the connection. So now electrons can travel through that as well. So it becomes this very negatively charged substance, structured water. And the positive hydrons or hydrogens that are cleaved off create a very um positive concentration over here. So you have a positive and a negative next to each other, um, and that's a battery, right? So we all know there's positive and negative ends on a battery, and that's the reason the reason for that is because that creates this charge, creates energy when you have this charge separation. And so they've actually done experiments in Dr. Pollock's lab at the University of Washington where they take an electrode and they stick it into the positive end, into the negative end, and they bring those back to a light bulb, and they can turn on a light bulb and power a light bulb because that's creating energy. So structured water is a way that our body holds energy and creates storage form of energy. And so in this case, in a tube, when you get that energy concentrated there, it does the work of moving the fluid through the tube. And so that's exactly what we see in our arteries and our veins, is that we see the structured water forming a lining and it creates this flow. And they've actually shown this in chick embryos where they stop the heart from beating in the chick embryo. Um, and uh, and then they the the blood continues to move for up to 15, 16 minutes afterwards. And then when they shine infrared light on it, they increase blood flow 300%. So when they build more structured water, the blood continues to move. So the heart is sitting in the middle of this river of blood that's already flowing or should already be flowing, right? If we're in the right environments of creating structured water. So why going back to my example of me sitting in the sun and my heart rate increasing, even though I'm just sitting there, not stressed about anything, just sitting there, it's because when I'm creating infrared light, or I'm putting infrared light on my body creating structured water, that's increasing the flow of fluid, right, in the in the arteries and veins. And so when the flow increases, the heart has to beat faster to keep up, right, to that flow. And there's studies that show that too, where they actually increase the heart rate, but the blood flow does not increase, right? And so if they increase the blood flow, like I'm doing sitting in the sun, the heart rate does increase because now the heart has to keep up with the flow of blood. Um, and so that's an example there, right? So that's the structured water conversation. I mean, there's more to it than that as far as like its role in atherosclerosis and clotting and those types of things. But from a function of the heart perspective, the role of structured water is to keep blood moving, is to provide uh the movement of blood. Now, there's other things that create movement of blood too, you know, the contraction of muscles. Uh, there's one-way valves in the veins that kind of keep it from backflowing and things like that. But the main way that that we get fluid flow in the body in general, not just blood, but any fluid flow, lymphatic fluid and uh extracellular fluid, all that stuff, it moves through structured water, forming, creating flow fluid. And the main way we build structured water is infrared light. Why does that make sense? Because anytime the sun is up, it's 40 to 50 percent infrared light um all day long. So it makes sense. We're supposed to be charged by the sun.

SPEAKER_01 36:33

Right. Oh, and that is to me, it was such a fascinating thing learning this. And um, Dr. Pollock, as you mentioned, he's got a bunch of videos online, but you can see when they put light on it. And so if for those of you listening, you can almost picture like all layers in your blood. You've got the wall of the artery itself, but then you've got this water that expands and pushes out everything else that's in the blood, and then you've got the blood that's carrying all the oxygen or nutrients and the things that are in it. But it's that that the more light, the more that structured water expands. And it's it's that being the energy really did shift how I started seeing things. And it made me think of one, two things. One is what breaks it down, but the other one is what um what's why the importance of that structure or that buffer against the lining of the arteries is important. And so though tell me if I'm over the target here, because what made sense to me as you were explaining that was the idea that like without that buffer, it's some things can rough up or scratch almost like something like sandpaper on the walls of our arteries if that exclusion zone isn't there protecting them and stuff doesn't slide like it should, or even thought of you know, relative to the heart or the expansion of our um artery system, the idea of like uh almost like stretch marks on the skin, like that that pressure as it increases stretches that wall. And the more friction there is against it, like stretch marks are scar tissue, right? That's where you there's not as much flow or there's not as much blood and no in and scar tissue. And so, one, before we get to what can break down the structured water, does that am I making sense of of the analogy or the what you were talking about here, that the the water is the buffer that protects the lining? And when that buffer is reduced or eliminated, that's what's creating a lot of the damage in our circulatory pipes. Is that accurate?

SPEAKER_00 38:21

Yeah, so I I I believe, based on all the literature that I've looked at, that structured water is supposed to be there on the lining of the arteries, protecting the lining of the arteries. I mean, if you look at so people may know that there's like there's an endothelial cell on the lining of the artery, uh, this layer of endothelial cells, and on those cells are coming out this thing called the glycocalyx, which is kind of like this shag carpet brush border kind of thing. Um, and and uh everybody talks about the health of the glycocalyx. Um and but the glycocalyx is described as this anticoagulant gel layer. And anytime the body wants uh structured water to form, it will create surface area. So, what does this shag carpet-like thing do? It creates a lot of surface area, right? More surface area than if there was just a layer of endothelial cells straight across. So we the glycocalyx is the surface area by which structured water can form and it creates this gel-like layer on it. Um and so that creates this, they they call the glycocalyx slippery, right? We just talked about how structured water creates a slippery surface. Um, that's its job. So that that creates this uh friction on the surface where things with the blood are moving through, gliding through without damaging, without creating sheer stress, right? On the lining of the artery. Um, and so it also is what creates the movement of blood in the first place is the energy that's created in that barrier. So it creates the movement. Now, yeah, what can happen if that system starts to break down? Well, first of all, why would it start to break down? It would it would be like um if we don't have enough energy pretty much. So that's the simplest way to describe it is we're not getting enough energy to the system. Because if we get injured to the system, the body's gonna store that energy by building structured water, whether that's in the cells or in the lining of the artery or anywhere else. And so if we're not, if we don't have enough structured water, we're not getting enough energy from our environment. Or we're exposed to a lot of things that are stealing that energy, right? So we're either not in enough infrared light, we're not grounded enough, we have unhealthy metabolism, which are all ways that we gain energy in the form of electrons from our environment. This is, you know, everything out here in the universe is is about energy, you know, energy conservation and and getting energy from the environment, using that to create order. Order is what we call health. And so if we're depriving ourselves of those energy situations, then we're not getting enough energy. But also you can be exposed to things like toxins or wireless signals and things like that that have been shown to steal the energy, uh, steal the electrons from our bodies, mainly structured water, and interfere with its ability to form. And if that happens, yes, we leave the lining of the artery vulnerable, right? It doesn't have this protective layer anymore. And then those same things that then damaged the glycocalyx and the structured water are now damaging the endothelial layer. But plaque does not form there. Plaque does not form in that situation. What happens when that damage happens to the endothelial layer is those cells start to try and repair, which is what cells do. If you cut your skin, your body tries to repair it, right? And the way that it tries to repair things is it has this growth and proliferation of cells, makes new cells take the damaged ones and try and get rid of them, which is what we see, this whole immune process happening on the lining of the artery, and then this proliferation of new cells, grow new cells to make it healthy again. Kind of like when a scab is kind of, or like when you cut your skin, it's kind of swollen for a little while, right? Um, there's fluid being released, but also there's this kind of proliferation of cells. And that's happening on the lining of the artery. And those cells that line the artery, they also need a blood supply. And that blood supply does not come from the blood flowing through the middle of the artery, it comes from the small arteries that come around the other side called the vasovazorum that supply the um the lining of the artery and uh with the those cells with blood, right? The vasovizorum does that. Now, when we grow new artery or new cells in the middle of the artery, then those vasovizorum have to grow new arteries to kind of go to those new cells, right? And when they start to grow, um it's just like building anything from scratch, right? If you if you build a house, there's at some point, there's a point when there's no windows and doors on it. And so these arteries are leaky. And so as they're growing into this lining of the artery or into the wall of the artery, uh, and they're incomplete, blood starts to leak out of them. And when it leaks out, stagnant blood is no longer in a tube, it's no longer moving. What does stagnant blood do? It clots. And we get this clotting material, not on the lining of the artery at first, in the middle of the artery, but in the wall of the artery. And that's where we see plaque develop. In the intimal layer of the artery, we get this formation and it goes both ways. The artery expands both ways. It doesn't just go to the middle like that, it goes both ways. And so we get this pushing out, and that creates this stenosis in the middle of the artery, right? Um, and so it all starts with the breakdown of structured water and then insult to the lining of the artery, and it starts the whole process from happening or starts the whole process happening. Um, so that's atherosclerosis. That's why the structured water is relevant. Now, whether or not those plaques cause heart attacks is a different conversation, which we can talk about if you want to. Um, but that's that's what we call atherosclerosis, this plaque that forms in arteries, which technically studies show if you have higher amounts of plaque in your arteries, higher risk of heart attack. Why is the important question to answer? But that's what everybody's tracking. That's what medicine's obsessed with tracking. They want to track down the plaque, they want to treat the plaque and try and prevent heart attacks. That's not really working well that for that well for them. But um, but yeah, that's that's how structured water is relevant to this conversation.

SPEAKER_01 43:48

That's fascinating. I that was a great analogy of how it heals from the other side of the arterial wall. Like it makes so much more sense of why I would be doing that. And I love your windows and doors analogy of like, yeah, I'm not done. I've just Got scaffolding and and some of the stuff is getting through if there's too much pressure. And yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:04

And the other thing is that is being insulin resistant, which being diabetic and insulin resistance is the number one risk factor for developing plaque in your arteries. And the reason that is, is that when your body's trying to grow new arteries in that situation, um, it's not able to do so as well as it should be if you're insulin resistant. Insulin is needed for growth and repair of the formation of new things, but also repair the lining of the arteries. So if you're insulin resistant, you're diabetic, um, type two diabetic, then that's happening, not happening as well. And the arteries stay leaky for longer. So you develop more plaque, right? Um, and that's why diabetes is so associated with higher rates of atherosclerosis. Again, is atherosclerosis um the cause of these heart attacks? That's a different conversation, but but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:48

That's great. Okay. Well, before we leave the structured water thing, the topic, um, give us a few examples. You mentioned um like EMFs and such, but what other things break down or limit this structured water? I know one of the big ones was the polyethylene glycol that was in a recent injection that most of humanity seems to have gotten. So talk about that, but any other things that are known to break down this water that might be creating some of this stress that's leading to the process you just laid out.

SPEAKER_00 45:15

Yeah. So it it people may be familiar with terms like oxidative stress or inflammation, right? And those are things that we've we've deemed to be indicators of having poor health, right? Or more likely to get disease if you're have high oxidative stress or high inflammation. To me, all that can be explained by this simply by this charge conversation, right? Our bodies need to be net negatively charged. When we build structured water in our bodies, we're gaining electrons from our environment, whether it's direct sunlight, being grounded, healthy metabolism, we're and harvesting the chemical bonds from food and gaining electrons from that. We're trying to gain electrons from our environment, and our body stores those electrons via structured water. So things like oxidative stress or inflammation are just signs that our body is either being exposed to too many things that are stealing that charge or making it hard for that charge to build up. Or, like, I mean, what is oxidative stress? Oxidative stress is something, is a molecule or free radical that wants it to gain an electron. So it steals an electron from something, including structured water, it would steal that electron from that, right? If we have lots of things in our bodies that can act like um uh free radicals and cause oxidative stress, then we're in this low charge state and we get this inflammation, right? So anything that's an indicator of inflammation just means that the body doesn't have enough charge. And so that means we're not spending enough time in environments that gain charge to the system, enough infrared light, enough time being grounded, having a healthy metabolism, which you know it's only 6.8% of the population is estimated to be metabolically healthy, um, those types of things. And then we're also being exposed to things like you mentioned that are stealing the charge. So things that make it hard, right? So you think about this. Um we're talking about EMFs. So the only light that humans are supposed to be exposed to, and all life on this planet is supposed to be exposed to, is the electromagnetic wavelengths of light from the sun, right? That's UV through infrared. Um, and that's it. Um the only those are the radio frequencies, the light energy, right? The only electromagnetic frequencies we're supposed to be exposed to is that of the earth or other living things. So these are all this is all light information, right? So this is the electromagnetic spectrum. Now, outside of the electromagnetic spectrum of the sun, we have ionizing radiation, which is X-ray, gamma ray, all that stuff. And then we have non-ionizing radiation, which is um, you know, Wi-Fi, um, you know, all the wireless signals, radio waves, all that kind of stuff, microwaves, all those things. And we we talk about them like as these things that, like, oh, this is non-harmful, these are harmful, we know that's harmful, right? But this is the only thing we know is not harmful, is those electromagnetic spectrums from the sun. Anything outside of that, to me, is incompatible with life because it's a very new thing that we wouldn't have time to adapt to, right? Uh, and so so when you think about it that way, this light information from a wireless signal is incompatible. If infrared and all the spectrums of light from the sun will build structured water, infrared just does it the best. Um, then anything outside that spectrum will steal the charge, right? Make it hard to build structured water. And right now we are inundated with these electromagnetic fields that are outside that spectrum of what the sun gives us that are non-compatible with our physiology. And in one way they're non-compatible is that they're stealing charge. And there's actually a study that never really got published. It was a prepint, but then they never, the guy that helped Dr. Pollock do the study like disappeared or something. I don't know. Um, but it showed that when they exposed structured water to a Wi-Fi router, then it decreased it, I think, 10 to 15%. So it it it uh it makes it hard, it steals the charge, right? And then also any of the things that we see as things that cause oxidative stress, which having a poor glucose-based metabolism will create more free radicals. Free radicals are not bad, they're signaling molecules that the body needs, but when they get overproduced, it becomes a bad thing. And that can be a very processed food, glucose-based metabolism, but also lots of toxins. So heavy metals, herbicides and pesticides, plastics, you name it. All that stuff out there are things that steal charge from the body. And there's so it's no wonder that we see associations, we see research that shows associations between exposure to those things and plaque in the arteries because it's destroying structured water. Um, even uh endotoxic bacteria, but from leaky gut or from poor dental health and dental infections and things like that, that bacteria leaks into the bloodstream and your body attacks that bacteria, but the endotoxins in the bacteria are released, and those endotoxins are incredibly inflammatory, lots of oxidative stress, and there's a heavy association between having LPS, endotoxic bacteria, gram-negative bacteria in your bloodstream, and in atherosclerosis. So that's kind of this unifying theory. It explains why all these things have been associated with higher rates of it, because we're talking about destruction of structured water. Um, and that's the Wi-Fi signals, that's the toxins, and it's us not being in the environments we're supposed to be in, you know, to build that structured water and protect ourselves in the face of all those other exposures. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:17

That's such a great holistic look at the heart and at what how the role of the water and the and why I love it when you find things like that, because suddenly all these seemingly disconnected, mysterious symptoms or correlations, they have a unifying theory that starts to make sense of it. So um, a question I get a lot or I um hear people talk about is this concept of having high blood pressure. And that's just in the medical world, it's kind of this mysterious thing that comes out of nowhere, and the best we can do is just take a medication to artificially regulate the blood pressure. So, where in the conversation or the understanding that we've laid out so far, how would you describe what creates a scenario of high blood pressure and what are some of the ways people can manage that?

SPEAKER_00 50:59

Um, well, first of all, we have to define what high blood pressure is. Exactly. Thank you. So yeah. So, like just like they've messed with the the recommendations for what cholesterol should be, should be, right, over the years. Um, they've lowered that over the years so that more people would need the medication, right? People need medication based on the thing they decide it should be, which there was no research to what it should, it should be 100, right? That's what they say it should be now, but there was no reason to suggest that would be what

Blood Pressure What Numbers Miss

SPEAKER_00 51:25

it would be. Same with blood pressure. In 2017, they just lowered again. Like it was like your blood pressure needed to be 140 over 90 to constitute what's high blood pressure. That would that they could diagnose it with high blood pressure at that point, and they lowered that to 130 over 90 or 130 over 85 or something like that. They lowered it again, which made at that time in 2017, that made half the population of people in the United States um would need medication at that point. Um, so that means one of two things. That means that either we are incredibly unhealthy as a population, which is true, right? Only 6.8% of people are estimated to be metabolically healthy, or it means that that um the the way that we're um, I guess, assessing people's risk is way overestimating that risk. And there's research to, again, to show that both of those things are true. There's there's research that shows that the the cardiovascular risk calculator used overestimates risk by like 500%. Um we look at these things and then people's actual health outcomes. And then, like I said, there's evidence to show that we're also unhealthy as a population. So it's probably a combination of both. Um, but if you look at like, you know, the the research from that showed that that kind of dictated this whole thing or started this whole thing that high blood pressure was bad for us, um, came from the framing data, which is like the largest ongoing study there is in Framingham, Massachusetts. And but if you look at that data, it really only showed that blood pressure really only created higher risk or was harmful at 70 to 80 percent above what's normal, right? So if we take 120 over 80 as normal, which again, there's no such thing as normal in my opinion. Your body's always supposed to be adapting to different things. Um, but if we take 120 over 80 as normal, that means that a blood pressure of like 215 over 160 or something would be and that elevated and consistent, consistently at that level, that's what really predicts risk. So someone's coming in with 160 over 90 or something like that. The research is clear, very clear, that um in people like that, especially as we age, the higher their blood pressure is, the less cause of death they have. The lower all-cause mortality they have, the higher their blood pressure is, as long as it doesn't get that elevated and stay there, right? So we're medicating people at 160 over 90 and driving their blood pressure lower. And there's studies that show that people over 60 and people over 75, if they have blood pressures lower than 130 over um, I think 80, that they have a higher risk of mortality. Um so we're driving that down. And not to mention the fact that um we're over medicating them for this blood pressure, we're also getting creating issues with that, like electrolyte imbalances, kidney issues, uh, we're increasing risk for fainting and falling, um, which is, you know, uh can increase risk of injury. Like we're like, and there's there's one study that shows that the uh quote unquote benefits of taking blood pressure medication do not outweigh the risks because there's really no benefit to medicating someone who's at 150 or 160 over 90, right? Um now if it gets high and stays there, it's like, okay, now we need to lower it a little bit. But to me, it's not the increased blood pressure that creates risk, right? We all think that like we see increased blood pressure, and technically there's some studies if it gets that high that it's associated with more risk of uh stroke or heart disease or whatever. However, it's not the blood pressure that's creating the risk. It's the things that are creating, making your body create high blood pressure that are creating the risk. What is that? Insulin resistance, stress, right? Lack of structured water in your arteries. Because if you don't have structured water and the fluid is not moving, what does the artery do? It constricts, trying to get the blood to move faster. Kind of like putting your thumb over a water hose, the water moves faster out of it, right? So it's trying to create less, less uh volume uh or less um yeah, volume of that tube so that the blood goes faster. So if you don't have enough structured water, it's not moving properly, it'll constrict, creating more pressure. So yeah, there's there's just a lot of or a lot of lack of trying to understand the mechanisms of why blood pressure is there. How does it actually create risk when it gets that high? When is when is it actually high? And all that stuff. And they're just trying to medicate, right? They're just saying, okay, we're gonna lower with medication, and that's not fixing anything. Um, I mean, it's getting a desired effect of low blood pressure, but is that healthier for us? Is that fixing the issue? No, none of those things are. So so yeah, there's all there's a lot there as well.

SPEAKER_01 55:34

Yeah, well, that's and hopefully we got closer to somebody having actual informed consent if they choose to go on a medication like that. But it essentially what I think you're saying, and correct me if I can say it better, but these blood pressure medications, they basically just override and take over the body's ability to regulate how much pressure it puts through it. So you can't get above or below particular levels. And to your point, if the body had a need for doing that, too bad, it just really can't get there. And it's all the side effects of the inability to hit different ranges that can create various problems with our health. Did I reasonably sum that up well?

SPEAKER_00 56:09

Yeah, I mean, it's it's a very good way of putting it in that, and this is a very important point to make, is that if your body is increasing your blood pressure, right, it's because it feels that it needs to be that. Right. Right. The body is not stupid, it's not gonna do anything that um would uh harm you. Like the body's not gonna do anything that would harm you, it's only gonna respond to the environment. So if your body is responding to the environment in a way that ends up causing harm, it's the environment's fault, not your body's fault. Right. And what medicine is doing is treating the body, is it's manipulating the body into doing something different despite the environment. And that's not okay because we have to change the environment to get a different result in the body. So your body's not doing anything wrong. If it feels like blood pressure needs to be higher, then it feels that way for a reason. If you suppress that, people aren't getting what they need, right? And then there is a point where it gets to be too high. If it stays there and it stays there consistently, this is a problem. That's the only time I would say that we need medication, but that's not me giving a bicep, me just giving my general opinion. Um, but medicine doesn't see it that way. They've given this benchmark, and we have to meet that benchmark. That means you're healthy. The only problem is research shows that doesn't make you healthier. Um, you don't live any longer, you don't live any higher quality of life, you've just met the number. So it's like, great, you died earlier, but you had good blood pressure because you took your medication.

SPEAKER_01 57:25

You had good what we told you was good based on the averages of the city.

SPEAKER_00 57:29

Same, same with the cholesterol studies, right? It's like they go over the cholesterol and they say, look, statins are great. They lower cholesterol, but you died earlier of something else. Like, great, you had good cholesterol, but you died earlier. That's what they show. It increases all-cause mortality if you have lower cholesterol. So what's the benchmark we're looking at here?

SPEAKER_01 57:45

Yeah. Well, you had a whole hour-long chapter in your book about the cholesterol myth. And I've done my fair share of beating up on that topic and just reviewing the history and showing how the nutrient deficiencies it creates alone are actually creating the one thing they're telling you that they're preventing. So I guess an episode about the heart wouldn't be complete without mentioning statins and cholesterol. So give people maybe your little, I don't know, five minute or so soapbox about statins, cholesterol, or the cholesterol lowering agenda, et cetera, et cetera.

SPEAKER_00 58:15

Yeah, I'll do it by giving two examples. So the first one is this lean mass hyperresponder conversation, right? So I don't know if your audience is familiar with that, so I'll kind of detail that a little bit. So, you know, there's there's these subset of people, which I think it's actually everybody, just depends on their metabolic health. But if you go on low-carb diets, your LDL will go up. Why would that be? Because if you go on a low-carb diet, you're giving

Cholesterol And Statins Under A Microscope

SPEAKER_00 58:37

your body one fuel source to burn, and that is fatty acids or to make ketones. And so in order to deliver those fatty acids to your tissues, it delivers those fatty acids via LDL molecules. That's what carries the fatty acids. So if you only have one fuel source to burn, that is fatty acids, it has to deliver more of those to the tissues so LDL can go up to deliver more of those to the tissues, right? And that's what we see. And then if you ate carbohydrates, you give your body glucose to burn. So then the glucose, you wouldn't, your body wouldn't need to deliver as many fats, so the LDLs would come down. And that's been demonstrated by uh many different people, but in the literature by two different people, Dave Feldman and Nick Norwitz, Nick actually lowered his cholesterol um uh half or uh twice as good as a statin drug did by eating Oreo cookies. Um he would go on a low carb diet and his LDL would go up because he's a lean mass hyperresponder, and we're talking like 300 and something. Um and then he went on, he ate 12 Oreo cookies a day for I think 16 days or something, and his LDL went down like over 270 points or something like that. And then he went back on his low-carb diet and his LDL went up and took a statin drug, and it brought his LDL down, but only like 100 points. So the Oreos worked way better because this is about metabolism. It's not about, it's not about risk of heart disease, it's about what your body's choosing to metabolize. So here's the thing the reason I bring that up is because, you know, we can get into all the literature and no, this study says that, this study says this, but these are the these are the real impactful things that I think make more of a difference for people. And that is that people go on low carb diets all the time, and you hear this story over and over again. And it's not really that the low carb diet is what's necessary, it's just achieving metabolic health and the low carb diet is is how they're doing that. And so they achieve this metabolic health on this low carb diet and they lose weight, people you know, fix their IBS, their mental health disorders are going away, or people go on low-carb diets and things like this, and they see all these health benefits. They have more energy, um, their diabetes goes away, all this stuff, and they look great, and the doctor's man, you look great. What are you doing? And they're like, Oh, I'm on a low-carb diet. And then the doctor looks at their number and they see the LDL up, and they're like, You gotta stop that. That's bad for you. Yeah, right. So this is just and the reason I say it like that is because that doesn't make any sense. There's it doesn't make sense that you do something and your body has all these wonderful health benefits, but it's also killing you.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:53

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:54

That makes no sense whatsoever. And it's basically we've people have lost the ability to look at how their bot what their body's communicating to them rather than um trying to make their numbers look like this on a on a panel, right? If the numbers look like this, then I'm healthy. It's like, well, if your numbers look, I know people look, their blood will look exactly perfect and they're overweight and have um all these issues and all this kind of stuff, right? So this like that's a disconnect that we're having, and medicine is teaching us that, oh, they have the answers. This is what tell you that are healthy when in reality your body will tell you. Um, so so yeah, that's the big thing there. So that's the best example I can give, I'd say, of like why cholesterol is not the cause of heart disease, because it can't be doing two things at the same time. If your body is, again, just like the blood pressure thing, if your body's raising your cholesterol is because it thinks it needs to, or it does need to, right? Because to deliver more energy to the tissues, because you're giving it that fuel source. And that's just a metabolic change. Um, and then and then, you know, it you also get all these health benefits from that. And so it can't be killing you, right? Um, so there's examples of people now who who've been on low carb diets for many, many years. Um, Nick Norwich just published a study on himself where he's had a total cholesterol of over 700 for seven years, and he just got all his imaging and he has no plaque in his arteries whatsoever. So there's obviously more to this plaque conversation. Um, so yeah, the other thing is the statin conversation. Like lowering, there's a there's a again, I try not to talk too much about the studies, even though I could, but there is a study. There's a study that looked at 21 different clinical trials for on statins, and they showed that if all those studies, they they um present the data as um as relative risk. So and relative risk highly inflates the benefit of these things. But there's a study that looked at 21 of these clinical trials on statins, the ones they use to tout their benefits, and it looked at it as absolute risk. So the actual absolute risk reduction of taking statins, and it's negligible. It's like 5% or less for all of them, which means that you could have repeated the study and got the exact opposite in the in the benefit the other way, right? And matter of fact, that's what they do. They just repeat studies over and over again until it looks like the the negligible absolute risk benefit is for the statins, and they publish that one rather than the other ones that didn't show that. Um, however, aside from that, well, just so people understand like absolute versus relative risk. So there's one study called the Ascot trial, and um it showed that there was a treatment group and a control group, a group that took statins and a group that didn't. In the statin group, 98.1% of people did not have a heart attack. In the control group, where people didn't take statins, 97% of people did not have a heart attack. So technically the statin group was 1.1% better. That's the absolute risk reduction, is 1%, which is not typically significant. You could repeat that study and you could flip it the other way. It it just is likely that it would happen by chance it would flip the other way, right? But however, what they did in the study is they took that 3% of people in the control group that didn't that did have a heart attack and compared it to the 1.1% of people who did um uh have a heart attack, and they said, Oh, you get a 33% or 36% risk reduction, relative risk reduction. So relative to each other, but I don't care what the relative risk is. I want to know if you take 100 people and and you give one the statin and one doesn't, what's the difference between the two? And the difference is 1%. That doesn't mean anything. There is no difference uh based on that. And so that's what they do to manipulate these things. But then the more, I think, more um the one that hits home more, I would say, is that now, you know, this idea that cholesterol is not the cause or it's not the sole thing is is coming out there. So doctors are now saying, yeah, well, well, statins have been shown to increase the amount of calcified plaque. So it's hardening the plaque, which means there's less soft plaque, which is the risk of rupturing. And we've already talked about how plaque ruptures probably don't cause heart attacks, but that's safer, right? To have the hard plaque. So we're giving you the statins to increase the calcified plaque. The only problem with that is that the studies are very, very clear that the more calcified plaque you have in your arteries, the higher risk of heart attack you have. So which one do you want? Yeah, do you want to increase the calcified plaque and prevent plaque ruptures? Or do you like, or do you want to, or is that just also increasing the risk of heart attack itself? Like, because then when you don't understand the mechanisms of why more calcified plaque increases the risk of heart attack, then that's what that's how you end up operating. The other thing is that statins have been shown to um increase the likelihood that someone is diagnosed with type 2 diabetes. They increase insulin resistance, right? Which is the number one risk factor, like I talked about for plaque. So so we shouldn't have to take a drug to prevent a disease by lowering cholesterol and also increase the risk for the disease. That doesn't make sense.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:40

No, it does not.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:41

It does not make sense. And that's the simplest way I can put it. That does not make sense, right? And whether or not someone chooses to take a statin drug is up to them. All I can do is give these examples and give it from my perspective, and they make those decisions. I'm not telling anybody to do anything, nor do I tell my clients that. Whatever you decide, I support, you know? Um, so yeah, that's the that's the easy cholesterol statin, the easiest cholesterol statin the conversation I could have.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:06

That was fantastic. That even helped me clarify a few more things. I love the you know, keto versus or the the producing ketones versus running on glucose and the the difference in what that does to cholesterol. That was a new penny that dropped. That's brilliant. But I love that you expose some of the chicanery of studies and how they, yeah, well, there's you know 98 versus 97 percent, or it's so different, isn't it? And that's what goes on in the world of pharma friends. And once you can see the wizard behind the curtain, it's easier to go, you know, I don't know about that. But um, one other one we haven't touched on is the idea of blood thinners, which I as I got into this, I realized they're not actually thinning the blood, they're just anti-clotting medications. There's something that keeps the body from being able to clot at various stages of your body doing that. So that obviously relevant to what you were just talking about with this potential for scarring and clotting and so on. So give the listener a little perspective on blood thinners. Now, what are they doing and what are they preventing the body from doing? And see if we can get a little informed consent around that uh line of thinking as well.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:07

Yeah. You know, like I mean, yeah, technically baby aspirins and the pharmaceutical blood thinners, um, you know, they thin the blood, so to speak. But really, like you're saying, they prevent a clotting response. Like the clotting, like the blood thinners prevent, you know, some factor in the clotting cascade from activating, so it prevents this clotting response.

Blood Thinners What They Block

SPEAKER_00 1:07:27

Um and uh uh the aspirins, they uh are COX2 inhibitors, so they're interfering with the inflammatory response that would happen from healing, which is less likely things are less likely to clot. So they're they're mechanisms by they're interfering with the body's normal physiology, right? Um again, trying to force or manipulate the body to do something. Um, but go to any cardiologist and ask them, hey, do you have patients who have blood tennis who still have heart attacks? And they'll say yes, right? So it doesn't necessarily prevent them. Like you may have some studies that show that maybe it it it's less likely to happen, you know. Statins do have a technically a very mild benefit, and that's because they have very um they have very mild anticoagulative and anti-inflammatory effects, right? Very mild, but they also have all these side effects as well. I would much rather give those, get those anti-inflammatory and anticoagular effects from other things, right? So the real way that we thin the blood, right? Um, well, because I guess the the issue, first of all, is that we need the body to have a healing response and a clotting response sometimes. There's a reason that's there, you know, which is why on blood thinners, you know, long-term use of blood thinners can create internal bleeding, um GI system bleeding, or God forbid you injure yourself and you're bleeding, and you're more likely much more likely to bleed out if you're on a blood thinner and not have that clotting response. So, um, but the real way that we thin the blood, right, from a biophysics perspective, instead of interfering with the biochemistry, a biophysics perspective, is we build structured water in the arteries, right? So, way back in 1856, Rudolph Birchow told us that what causes clotting in a vein or an artery is when we have damage to the lining of the artery, when we have poor stagnant blood flow, changes in hemodynamics, and when we have blood that's too thick or viscous or sticking together too much sticky blood. Um, and structured water prevents all those things. We already talked about how it forms or it's supposed to form on the lining of the artery, which protects the lining of the artery from the damage, which is Burchow's triad number one, is the endothelial damage. Um it keeps blood moving, right? It creates that blood flow, which is less likely to be stagnant blood that clots if we're having adequate blood flow. And uh structured water also forms around all the elements of blood. It forms around the lipoproteins, it forms around um uh the red blood cells. Anything that's in blood, it's also a hydrophilic surface and it forms around that. And when structured water forms around those things, all those things have a negative charge. They call it zeta potential. The researchers call it zeta potential. They don't recognize that it's um structured water. And like charges repel each other. So nothing's gonna stick together and get clumpy and viscous if we have this negative charge, right? So that but also the positive charge of the hydrogens that are formed or cleaved off are kind of attracting those negative charges to the hydrogen or to the positive charge. But if they get close enough to each other, they repel each other. So everything is kind of electrostatically attracted to each other. They're kind of linked as things are moving through the blood like train cars, like this, but they're not clumped together like this, right? So agglutination or relow formation are things we can see on red blood cell analysis, and those are indications of low charge of the body, right? So if we want to thin the blood or prevent clotting from a biophysics perspective, we need energy. We need electrons, which is again infrared light, grounding, metabolic health, avoid EMF, avoid toxins. Like that's that's what that's what we've got to do, which is not the way the average person is living today, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:43

Yeah. No, if you think about clotting, if you get some pictures, it's like magnets that repel each other. The cells shouldn't be sticky and stuck to each other. They should have enough charge, enough energy that they repel, which gets us strictly out of a chemistry equation. It gets us into, like you said, biophysics. There's more going on than just hydrogen, oxygen, and other aspects of chemistry. So well done, Dr. Hussi. I love it. Okay. So let's you you mentioned for your story, I want to get to the part where you piece together what you think happened to you, but you also mentioned they put a stent in. And so give people an understanding of stents. But what the one of the fascinating things the body does is collaterals are building um ways to get around blockages in our artery, because it's a common thing that the system uses to, oh my gosh, you're 95% blocked. We got to get operate on you now or you're gonna die. And it's just all the alarm bells go off. So talk about stents and collaterals and and the body's ability to adapt around what's happening.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:36

Yeah. So yeah, going back to my story, like I'll tell this through my story and like what happened because that's the easiest way to do it for me. Like they went in, they did a heart cath procedure, they found this 100% blockage of the LAD, right? And it's like, oh, that's the cause. We gotta fix that. And so they did. They did a balloon angioplasty and they placed a

Stents Collaterals And Stress Triggers

SPEAKER_00 1:11:56

stint in there, and my symptoms went away. Right. And they also gave me morphine at the same time, though, around the same time. Um, so I, you know, what did I actually feel versus not feel? I don't know. Um, but yeah, so but there's two important things there. So most of the time they'll they blame the heart attacks on these blockages. However, the statistics say that anywhere from five to twenty percent of the time they go in there and they don't find any blockage whatsoever. Someone's having a heart attack and they find no blockage, right? There's a study that I found uh a few months ago that looked at 4,307 people who um who had a heart attack or um had had a heart attack, and 66.3% of them did not have arteries considered to be obstructive, right? They had plaque, which means 50% or less stenosis, right? And so they said in the study, oh, all those people who had heart attacks must be plaque ruptures, right? That must be what caused it. And if they go in there and they don't find a blockage, they say, Oh, the body must have dissolved it before we got in there, right? And it's like, but the person was still having symptoms, right? And there's people that start having heart attack symptoms, like very severe, and before they get to the hospital, they they stop, right? They didn't have balloony angioplasty. So they say, oh, it must have dissolved the clot or whatever. But it turns out there's an entirely different mechanism here because they also go in all the time and they see people who have 100% blockage and they've never had a heart attack, never had heart disease symptoms. I know someone with a calcified plaque score of 5,600, which is astronomically high. Amount of calcified plaque and artists, never had a heart attack. He's an athletic guy, living life just like the way he wants to, he's just fine. Right. So how do we make sense of all this? Okay. So first of all, the research of Giorgio Baraldi, which his work just applies in the face of cardiology, but I've never met a cardiologist who's even heard his name. Um, but he was he was uh he was seen as a heretic, right, based on what he was finding. Um he did this work where he would inject um a plastic material, neoprene or latex material, into the arterial system of a heart on autopsies of people. He autopsied thousands of parts during his career. So if anybody's ever been to like the body world exhibits or the animal inside out exhibits, they'd have these, like there's like an arm they have there with a perfect plastic cast of the arterial system of the arm. Foraldi invented this procedure to do this. Um so they use it in science in this way, but they just his findings, they're like, no, no, no, we don't want that. Um, and so, anyways, he did this, and because the material was so uh able to get into very small arteries, even little tiny capillaries, he would uh let the plastic material harden and then he would dissolve away all the tissue with hydrochloric acid, and he would have a perfect cast of the arterial system of the heart. And what he found is that he looked at people with heart attacks, people without heart attacks, um, people who died of something else, anything. And he found people who had no history of heart disease who had 100% blockages in their arteries, but they had collateral arteries that went around it, right? Um, either that went around it or they had arteries from somewhere else in the heart come over and supply this area with blood. Um he found people who had a heart attack and the heart tissue death was over here, but the blockage they found was in a different artery over here that didn't go downstream to that.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:11

Right. So all these different things. But his main finding was that anytime that there was a 60 or 70 percent narrowing of an artery, it was always compensated by collateral arteries. And some of them were so small that there's no way you'd see them on an angiogram. So the doctors never see them, right? They never get picked up on an angiogram because they're so small, but there could be like 30 or 40 different collateral arteries that go around it. And so, and he never found a heart that um, because people, cardiologists would tell me that some people have collaterals, some people don't. And Baraldi never found a heart that wasn't that was 60 or 70% narrowed or more that didn't have collaterals. Happens 100% of the time. And people will tell me that collaterals, you know, take years to develop. But there's two different animal studies, one in dogs and one in rats, that show that um collateral arteries can form within four to seven days. So they gradually induce a stenosis in these animals. How they do that, I can't remember. Um, but then the body fully compensates the heart with flood and an animal that never had any symptoms whatsoever. So collateral arteries are a thing. So when they go and they find someone with 100% blockage, they've got collaterals, right? But even somebody with an 80% blockage very likely has collaterals. And the issue here is that when you look at the researcher, when they find someone with an 80% blockage, they go, oh my gosh, we got to stint this right away. If it's bad enough, we got to do a bypass surgery, we got to prevent this person from having a heart attack. First of all, if the person is sitting there with no symptoms, their body's clearly built collaterals, right? Because there's no way they're operating on 20% of the blood that needs to an area of their heart without any symptoms, right? So, so, but if they do have symptoms, maybe that suggests something different. I would suggest it's a different thing, which we're gonna talk about in a minute. But, anyways, if you try and treat the plaques, right? This person's got this 80% blockage. You go in there, you place an elective stint, or if it's bad enough, you do the bypass procedure, that's great, all well and good. Studies show that that can relieve symptoms. If they have symptoms, it can relieve symptoms for up to a year, which to me is placebo. They had this big operation thing and they say, Oh, it worked, but it never really didn't fix the problem, and the symptoms come back within a year. But the research on those things, elective stents and bypass procedures, shows that those procedures don't prevent future heart attacks. And it's not just some research says this way, someone says the other. All the research says that those things don't prevent future heart attacks because to me, the plaques aren't the cause of the heart attacks.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:21

And medicine is trying to make the plaques the cause of heart attacks and treat the plaques because it's very profitable for them to do so, but they're not actually treating the underlying cause, which means the person's just as likely to have a heart attack, right? So to me, what causes the majority of heart attacks, I'm not saying that it couldn't be an acute blockage that happens so fast the body doesn't have time to build collaterals, it's just immediate, which could have happened to me. But the more likely cause, in my opinion, is imbalanced nervous system signaling to the heart. Right. So basically we get this surge of stress signal to the heart without the lesser surge of non-stress signal that's supposed to balance it out and kind of keep it balanced to kind of break. So the analogy is if you're walking your dog on a leash and your dog sees your neighbor and it wants to attack your neighbor and it goes, but the dog's having that's the stress response. Is your dog wanting to attack your neighbor? The leash is the non-stress response, keeping that from becoming a catastrophic situation where your dog attacks your neighbor, injures him, and you get sued. Right. So that's the that's the situation here. So we have this stress response, your dog attacking your neighbor, but without the leash, right? Because our body has been trained to not have that, or we're so inflamed because we need nitric oxide, so we need something, and nitric oxide can be depleted under oxidative stress and inflammation. We need nitric oxide for the non-stress tendon to get in. So there's all these things that can create the situation. But, anyways, without getting too technical, what happens is we get this surge in stress response, and that causes a cascade of events in the heart tissue that that forces the heart to burn more glucose than it would like to, because the heart really prefers fatty acids to ketones. Studies have shown that over and over again. But when it starts burning more glucose, it's very similar to when you go for a run and your body's burning up glycogen in your muscle. What happens to your muscle? It starts to hurt. You get muscle pain, you get this muscle burn, which is what angina is. That's what heart pain is. It's this. And so when your heart starts to burn more glucose than it wants to, we start to get chest pain. If it happens bad enough, enough of a stress signal without the less stress signal, we get, we get tissue death. Because if you burn more glucose, that's very inefficient. It creates this swelling, it creates uh edema, it creates hydrogen ion buildup, it creates lactic acid buildup, and the swelling starts to push the tissue out like this. And now blood, the force of blood can't get in, right? Because the swelling is this way, and this heart tissue starts to die. Right. And so when that happens, it's also when it pushes like this, the blood can't get in. Right. And so that mechanism happens. And then when blood can't get in, now it's stagnant blood. And what does stagnant blood do? Clots.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:45

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:45

Right. And so there's a very fascinating case study but done by Baraldi himself. Um, he was doing a heart cath procedure on a guy, 45-year-old man. And the guy started having, while they were doing the procedure, they were in there looking at his arteries, they were finding plaque and everything. The guy had some plaque, but none of it was obstructive. And while he was there doing the heart cath procedure, the guy started having a heart attack. They they started seeing the EK uh G elevation, uh, ST elevation on the EKG. Um, he started having chest pain, uh, and the guy started having a heart attack, and they were in there looking and they were like, There's no blockage. We don't we don't feel blockage anywhere, right? And so it was the stress mechanism that caused this thing. However, 20 minutes later, they were in there for a long time. 20 minutes later, the blockage formed. Right? So that the tissue got bad enough, it died enough, and it created this swelling and swelling, pushing the blood back, blood came stagnant, it clotted, right? And so then they tried to place a stint, and this is something that happens in cardiology. They place a stint and people having a heart attack, and they get they call it the no-reflow phenomenon. They open it up and the blood still doesn't flow. Why? Because the pressure is coming from the blood. So they opened up the stent with the stent and it still doesn't go in because the pressure's coming from here, creating that mechanism down there. So that could have been what happened to me. I could have had the heart attack, right? And then by the time I got to the hospital, I developed a clot. And in that instance, both things need to be fixed, right? And so that's why the stent placement plus the morphine, which calmed my stress response, I think fixed my symptoms, right?

unknown 1:21:15

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:16

And so that's what happens. Now the question we need to ask is what percentage of heart attacks are this mechanism rather than blockage? Are they all that way? Are there some caused by blockage, some caused by not? Like we need to entertain these things. And what I'm saying here is not a theory of mine. I mean, I mean, it is a theory, but it's pieced together. I have a I have research to literally put together every single mechanism I just described to people. Um, and I think that at the end of the day, going back to this theme of this episode is that we need to trust our bodies. Like, exactly. You know, we know this. We know this. You know, I mean, first of all, there's tons of research to show that that heart attacks are more common on Monday mornings when people hate going back to their job, or stressful day of the years, like holidays or sporting events where people are betting on games or they take the game a little too seriously, right? There's tons of research to show that or daylight savings time, when we disrupt our circadian rhythm, heart attacks are more prominent, more likely to happen. We get an uptick in heart attacks on those days. We know that this is caused by stress, this autonomic nervous system imbalanced signaling. And further than that, we know it subconsciously. When someone scares you out from jump out from behind a door and scares you, people they say, Oh my gosh, you're gonna give me a heart attack.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:24

Right.

unknown 1:22:24

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:25

Oh, you bet we know.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:27

Yeah. We know this, this inherently, that this is what causes it. But medicine has made it about the plaque and the blockages. Meanwhile, there's tons of literature to throw that into question. I'm not saying that it's impossible that those things couldn't cause a heart attack, but when we try and treat those, it doesn't actually prevent your future heart attacks. So they haven't addressed the autonomic nervous system imbalance, right? Um, so I mean, and it's very fascinating because there is a small amount of research on beta blockers, and beta blockers um can reduce the risk of heart attack and things, but beta blockers have also been shown to increase parasympathetic signaling to the heart, which is exactly what they also come with type other side effects, but like that's a thing. So it's very interesting to learn about these things. Um, and uh and so it's uh so I can't sit here and say I know exactly what caused it. It could have been an acute blockage. Maybe there was a acute thing that happened and I had no collaterals yet because there was no plaque there to begin with. So there was no reason for the body to have collaterals, and that clot formed instantaneously and it stopped the flow of the artery, or it could have been the stress mechanism. If I talk about what I don't know if we have time, but if I talk about what led up to my heart attack and the stress I was going through, it completely could have been that too.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:34

No, actually. Go for it if you want to. I do think about ablations and arrhythmias, but go that finish this, your your thought because I think it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:43

Yeah, I mean, just for me personally, like I was dealing with a lot of stress. I mean, it was during COVID, there's lots of things happening during COVID that I didn't agree with and and uh was stressful to me. It was the first time in my life I got caught up in like politics and and that kind of stuff and those types of things. Usually I wouldn't even pay attention to the news. Um, it created some you know divide in family, which was stressful for me. And then I was going through some relationship stress. Um, and then a day and a half before the heart attack, I heard very stressful news about a close family member, and it was the inability of me or my family to get to this person because they were in another country. And during COVID, you couldn't go anywhere very quickly. Um, so we were just kind of hoping the situation will resolve itself. So I got very poor sleep that Monday night, tried to figure out how to get to this person all day Monday, couldn't had very poor sleep Tuesday night, woke up Tuesday morning and did a HIT workout in that state. Meaning high intensity in a probably shouldn't have done that. And 20 minutes later, I had the heart attack. So yeah, you could you could draw that picture, right? Perfect storm, right there. Yeah, yeah. You could also draw a picture of an acute clot happening, um, or yeah, many things, right? But um, I'll never know exactly. No one ever be able to tell me exactly what happened. All I know is that the things I do to either either balance my nervous system or prevent acute clotting in the future are the same things, right? That is set my circadian rhythm, have positive loving relationships, avoid toxins, um, you know, get infrared light, uh, be grounded, you know, eat a whole foods diet, avoid EMF, like uh don't have dental infections, um, you know, all that stuff, resolve past trauma, all the stuff, it's all the same. It's all the things that are gonna do those things. So that's the answer is you go forward and do those things. And when you understand those mechanisms of how those things prevent heart disease, that gives you freedom again.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:25

That does.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:26

Now you're not saying, now you're not saying this doctor or this test or whatever is gonna tell me that I'm healthy. You know you are, because if you act and live this way, you know you will be, and you know how it prevents it, and that gives you peace of mind, which is what I help my clients do, um, is understand those types of things.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:42

And I can imagine you do it so well. Because one thing that has come up twice, I've been thinking about as you were talking, was just how good the system is at making us fearful of what we can't see. And then the story they give us is like, of course, I whatever you say, even though I feel great, I should probably do this thing that doesn't make any sense. And it's that I've I can't tell you how many times in the last several months I've had people tell me, how am I supposed to know how I'm doing if I don't have a test? I'm like, how are you feeling?

SPEAKER_00 1:26:07

Like, and there's so many ways the body will give you the information about how you're doing, but well, and then and I think at the end of the day, you have to realize that those tests can't tell you that you're safe. It's literally impossible for them to. I'm the perfect example. Yeah. If you looked at me on paper, no risk of heart attack, maybe a slider increased risk because I'm type 1 diabetic. But otherwise, everything looked great. They would have told you you're good to go, still happened, right? Yeah. Um, and and I think that's a big thing that people I encourage people to get past is that there's a test that can tell you if you're healthy because that test does not determine your risk. First of all, it's one snapshot in time. It's not telling you anything about how it's changed since then, and it's changing all the time, those numbers. So, unless you were constantly monitoring them day in and day out, it doesn't tell you much of anything. But secondly, your environment determines your risk. I don't care what that test says, your environment can change what that test shows immediately. So now we have to learn about the environment that signals to your body to create health. And once you learn about that and you understand why at a deeper level, that's going to prevent you from having heart disease or any other disease. Now you're back in control. Now you're like, oh, I know if I do these things, I'm not a slave to that test or that doctor's approval that I'm healthy. I have agency over my health again. That's the most important thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:17

This is well said. I don't I couldn't say it better. So thank you for that because several of our people need to hear that. So um, last thing before we wrap up, you we talked a little bit about um heart, I mentioned ablations and the idea of arrhythmia. So this idea that my heart has an irregular beat. And I've, you know, ironically or not, I've got two clients right now. One has had an ablasion that worked out well, and another one had one that didn't help. And so my quick understanding of an ablation is it's this the heart is beating at what is perceived to be something irregular, and there can be symptoms that go with it. And an ablation is just either this electric shock or this freezing of particular nerve cells within the heart to basically destroy them or put a scar there so it can't signal it to beat. You're regularly anymore. So give the listener a little what you understand about arrhythmias or ablations and the risks that they may or may not be told relative to that.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:08

Well, the ablations are the perfect example of putting duct tape over a check engine light, right? Perfect example, right? Because

Arrhythmias And The Limits Of Ablation

SPEAKER_00 1:28:15

it's like, okay, your nervous system is giving you this aberrant signal that's causing this arrhythmia and your and your contraction of the heart. And we're just going to stop that from we're just going to kill that, right? So we'll just put the duct tape over it, right? Without any understanding of why your body's getting that signal to do that. So here's the thing your heart, we didn't get much into this, but your heart is, again, giving off the biggest electromagnetic field of any organ in the body. So it is perceiving your environment, external environment, sensing that environment, also your internal environment. It's sensing how well your body is synced up and communicating to itself. So if your body is has poor metabolic health or poor mitochondrial function, or you have lots of scar tissue in your fascia, and communication is not happening through the fascia or dehydration or lack of structured water, all those types of things can interfere with how your body's communicating to itself. Or from a biomechanical perspective, how is your nervous system telling your body to hold yourself biomechanically? So now we're looking at very chiropractic or posture restoration institute type things, which I don't know if people have heard of those things, but um, how how well is that stuff working combined with the EMF, this toxic relationship, all the other things from outside the environment? How are those, how is your heart sensing all this information? What information is that receiving, your heart receiving? Because your heart receives that information. And we feel that, like, you know, especially emotions, and we associate that with our heart, right? And that information is then relayed to your brain, either neurologically or electromagnetically, wirelessly, because your heart is sending off those signals and your brain is not in control. Like the brain that's sending the signal down for your heart to beat irregularly is not in control. It's just sending that signal based on the signals it's getting from its environment, right? From the heart from here to your brain. It's like the postal service. Your brain is not changing the messages. Hopefully, the postal service is not changing the messages, but just receiving the mail is oh, this goes here, right? We see the next thing, oh, this goes here, right? That's how it's working. So if we want to change the signals, your brain is signaling, we change the environmental signals your heart is getting. Um, and so then that information just comes down from the brain and goes back to the body. And so if our environment, internal and external, is totally off, then then um it can get this weird signal. And now our brain is giving this imbalance signal uh or um irregular signal uh to the heart, and we're starting to get these symptoms. We feel the flutter or we feel the aphib or whatever we feel. And so I guess the four or five main things that I would say to pay attention to when it comes to these arrhythmias is first of all, we can be predisposed to it. Um, like if our mothers weren't in the right environments, we can be predisposed um to having arrhythmia because the conduction system doesn't form properly. But even if you are predisposed, looking at electromagnetic field exposure, endotoxemia, dental affections, things like that, having that gram-negative bacteria floating around, um, it could be as simple as electrolyte imbalance. Um, I know many people who get more electrolytes in their diet because we're told salt is bad and that's not true. Um, they get more electrolytes and their aphib goes away. Um, it could be stored past trauma, um, or did I say EMS? I can't remember. You did. Um, yeah. So yeah, those are the big ones right there, right? So if we if we address those things, which are environmental type things, typically we can get a better signal coming down to the heart. Um, but you're not gonna hear that from the doctor. They're gonna try and just kill the nerve or give you a beta blocker or whatever. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:36

Man, that is you gave us a feast of biology and of practicality through this thing. I think maybe the only thing we didn't get to was the um, like that every time they talk about health, diet, and exercise, right? So the the one thing that you had in your book I loved was just your chapter on exercise and the heart. So go ahead and for some people spoil the idea that you know long, steady state cardio is a great thing for the heart, or give people like a few tips related to exercise and we'll we'll wrap up there and then tell people where you can find you.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:07

Technically, uh endurance athletes like the studies that show they have more plaque, right? But again, is the plaque cause of heart attacks? I don't know. You know, and to me, endurance athletes have more plaque because they have more time where blood is moving fast. So, like your arteries want to feel a certain amount of lateral pressure, like this Goldilocks amount of lateral pressure, right, on the on the interior line and kind of pushing out, which means we need enough fluid in the system. We also need it to be flowing properly.

Exercise Blood Flow And Plaque

SPEAKER_00 1:32:34

If it's flowing too fast, we're not getting enough lateral pressure, right? If it's flowing too slow, then um we we're um not getting enough lateral pressure either. It's kind of have this Goldilocks amount. To me, that's structured water speed of blood flow. That makes sense from a nature perspective. Um, so so yeah, we're we want blood to be moving at this Goldilocks amount. If it's too fast or too slow, it's like endurance athletes spend a lot of their time with blood moving very fast because they're exercising. Um people not in infrared light and not in the right environments have sludgy blood, it's moving too slow. And in both of those situations, the endothelial lining will start to grow in, right? It'll start to grow in to create that lateral pressure. And if that happens, um, the growth of the endothelium is again what we talked about, starts the whole process of these arteries from the outside having to grow in. And so technically they're at more risk of developing plaque. But again, does that increase their risk of heart attack? Technically, if they're in the wrong environments, right? We don't have because the reason that plaque in an artery increases the uh risk for developing uh having a heart attack is because that plaque is is pushing into the middle of your artery, creating interrupted blood flow. If you interrupt blood flow, you're more at risk for an acute clot to form. Um, especially if there's if it's not a bad enough amount of athospherosis that collaterals have been triggered to form yet. If that's the case and a clot forms, then so we need to be in those environments to prevent that from happening. So, so yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:57

Fantastic. Okay, well, much more detail he gets into in his book. So that's hopefully by now we have done a sufficient job wetting your appetite to go get his book. And for those, especially those of you who have heart disease or know somebody who does, I think you'll have such a holistic understanding of simple things that bring you a lot of peace when it comes to taking care of your heart and really by extension your whole body. So all right. Well, I have taken enough of your time for today. So thank you so much. Give people a chance to where do they find you? How do they follow your work? What would you like them to know as we wrap up here?

SPEAKER_00 1:34:30

Yeah, um, my website is resourceyourhealth.com. Um, and then all my handles for social media, YouTube, all that stuff is just Dr. Stephen Hussey, DR Stephen Hussey. Um, Stephen with a Ph. Uh, people can find me there, they can reach out on the website, they can message me on social media. Um, but yeah, I uh I have the book out there, but I also work with people in like a 12-week kind of mentorship, heart health mentorship program. Um, so people can look into that. Um, but yeah, that's where they can find me.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:58

Fantastic. Okay, well, I'll have all that linked for you guys in the show notes. So thank you so much. Any other parting thoughts you want to leave the audience with about uh to sum up our conversation today?

SPEAKER_00 1:35:09

Um no one's gonna care more about your health than you.

Where To Find Dr Hussey

SPEAKER_00 1:35:13

So all you can do is is learn as much as you can, and and that education allows you to make more informed health decisions that are right for you because that that right decision may be different for everybody. So um yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:26

Okay. Well, thanks so much for joining me today.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:28

Yeah, thanks for having me.